Hope Folks got their Starbucks on yesterday!

We got drinks Friday, does that count? lol

I cannot fathom how removing the ability to defend ourselves makes us safer. It just makes us victims.
 
yogoshio said:
We got drinks Friday, does that count? lol

I cannot fathom how removing the ability to defend ourselves makes us safer. It just makes us victims.
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It's actually very easy to fathom. Most of the countries with the least gun deaths per capita have the strictest gun control measures. The entire Rambo view of guns people have here is ridiculous. If I have the easy ability to poses a gun, and want to kill you, I'll just shoot you in the back and steal your gun if I find it.
 
Now in terms of this boycott, you guys can go all you want. But remember gun control is a liberal position. Most Starbucks locations aren't in farmland they're in cities. Not to mention it's a lot easier to boycott, and I can easily do it all week, than it is to keep spending money. I hope you guys really enjoy coffee if you want to break this boycott, because if it catches on, their profits are going to go down to the floor.
 
strike2867 said:
It's actually very easy to fathom. Most of the countries with the least gun deaths per capita have the strictest gun control measures. The entire Rambo view of guns people have here is ridiculous. If I have the easy ability to poses a gun, and want to kill you, I'll just shoot you in the back and steal your gun if I find it.
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The stat that pro control people always fail to acknowledge is the precipitous rise in violent crime soon after gun bans are put in place. If they don't have guns, they'll stab you with a knife.

A gun is an inanimate object much like a knife. It's the owner of either that transforms that object into a malicious one. If parents spent more time teaching their children morals, rather than handing them a PS3 and having very little influence in their lives, this could all be averted.

When I was a child, if I did something dumb, I got my azz whooped. I didn't dare disrespect anyone, or do anything I wouldn't want done to me. Is this parents fault, somewhat it is, but I would place the majority of the blame squarely on the shoulders of Hollywood, the music industry, and ultimately the government. If we didn't live in a society where both parents had to work ridiculously long hours in order to provide for their children, we wouldn't have the deranged people out there as we do now.

Another correlation that seems to be ignored is how most of these mass tragedies involve someone who went off their meds. Did they need them in the first place? We're too quick to pop pills to treat symptoms rather than the actual problems. I'm feeling down, I'll just pop some antidepressants. How about going out and doing something active?

I went off on a little tangent there, but the issues are all related to one another. I have many guns, and the only control I need is my mind, eyes, and finger because I control them all just fine.

Edit: Thought I'd throw this little quote in here as well: "if you outlaw guns, the only people that'll have guns are outlaws".
 
strike2867 said:
It's actually very easy to fathom. Most of the countries with the least gun deaths per capita have the strictest gun control measures. The entire Rambo view of guns people have here is ridiculous. If I have the easy ability to poses a gun, and want to kill you, I'll just shoot you in the back and steal your gun if I find it.
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They also have more violent crimes (rape, kidnapping) per capita. And your numbers aren't quite correct. Please see below.

Gun crimes have risen in the UK 35% in the last year alone. And guess what? Handguns are completely banned.
http://www.humanevents.com/2012/12/15/gun-crime-soars-in-england-by-35-where-guns-are-banned/
The United States ranks only #26 in the world for gun related crimes.
http://m.washingtonpost.com/blogs/w...homicides-compare-with-the-rest-of-the-world/
Concealed carry may not necessarily deter crimes, but there is strong evidence showing a direct correlation with a decrease in murders after a concealed carry law is put in effect.
http://m.washingtonpost.com/blogs/f...80a5d7e-47c9-11e2-ad54-580638ede391_blog.html

Finally, why would possessing a firearm make you want to kill someone and take their firearm? I myself, as well as many others in this state that have been denied concealed carry still possess firearms legally in our homes. Not myself nor any other here has ever murdered somebody simply because we possess a firearm.
Here's a few more stats for you. Note, these are actual stats and not theory.

http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp
 
DD said:
The stat that pro control people always fail to acknowledge is the precipitous rise in violent crime soon after gun bans are put in place. If they don't have guns, they'll stab you with a knife.

A gun is an inanimate object much like a knife. It's the owner of either that transforms that object into a malicious one. If parents spent more time teaching their children morals, rather than handing them a PS3 and having very little influence in their lives, this could all be averted.

When I was a child, if I did something dumb, I got my azz whooped. I didn't dare disrespect anyone, or do anything I wouldn't want done to me. Is this parents fault, somewhat it is, but I would place the majority of the blame squarely on the shoulders of Hollywood, the music industry, and ultimately the government. If we didn't live in a society where both parents had to work ridiculously long hours in order to provide for their children, we wouldn't have the deranged people out there as we do now.

Another correlation that seems to be ignored is how most of these mass tragedies involve someone who went off their meds. Did they need them in the first place? We're too quick to pop pills to treat symptoms rather than the actual problems. I'm feeling down, I'll just pop some antidepressants. How about going out and doing something active?

I went off on a little tangent there, but the issues are all related to one another. I have many guns, and the only control I need is my mind, eyes, and finger because I control them all just fine.
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1. Some kids don't have parents.
2. We live in a capitalistic society, it's hardly surprising both parents have to work.

I'm going to bet you've never known someone close or personally needed to be medicated. You don't know anything about that situation. Now if we had strict gun control, and that person went off the medication those tragedies would be a lot smaller.

But you mention violent crime going up if guns are banned. But what's interesting is the homicide rate for countries with strict gun control are also lowest in countries with strict gun control. Is there no crime without guns, of course not. Are there less homicides, gun or knife, yes.

One more thing, just about every poll shows Americans support stricter gun control, by large margins.
 
strike2867 said:
1. Some kids don't have parents.
2. We live in a capitalistic society, it's hardly surprising both parents have to work.

I'm going to bet you've never known someone close or personally needed to be medicated. You don't know anything about that situation. Now if we had strict gun control, and that person went off the medication those tragedies would be a lot smaller.

But you mention violent crime going up if guns are banned. But what's interesting is the homicide rate for countries with strict gun control are also lowest in countries with strict gun control. Is there no crime without guns, of course not. Are there less homicides, gun or knife, yes.

One more thing, just about every poll shows Americans support stricter gun control, by large margins.
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1. True, but I'm willing to bet a large majority of those people who gave those kids up grew up with crappy parents.
2. True again, but in the 50's and 60's, did we have as many psychopaths? I don't believe we did and they did perfectly fine with having one parent working and providing for the family.

And I hope you're not a gambling person because you're dead wrong. I know many people that need to be medicated, and I also know people who are medicated but don't need it. So I wouldn't go around generalizing what people know and don't know.

I'm not sure where you're getting your stats from because as Brian mentioned above, they're completely wrong. You're better off getting your info from non-partisan sources. I don't even bother watching right or left leaning media outlets because of the extreme biased views and skewed pseudo facts.
 
I'll have to agree with BB, and DD here for the most part. Only thing I would argue is the whole pshycopath thing. I think there were just as many in the 50's-60's. I think we just didnt hear about it as much as we do nowadays with the media being what it is today.
 
What I HATE about the anti-gun argument is that is based completely in "feels" facts, not reality. When looking at the US, it is statistically proven that the higher gun permit rates, the lower gun crimes. I don't care about other countries, because that's not what we're talking about. Our demographics are completely different from Europe and other nations.

Not only that, I could care less whether 99% of America wanted to ban guns, IT'S AGAINST THE CONSTITUTION. That's the whole reason it's there is to keep the masses from making the same mistakes from the past.

Remember the last time we required citizens to give up their guns? We slaughtered mass numbers of Native Americans. Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology, U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.

Living in Chicago, I can't figure out how you could say gun control means less gun violence. Gun violence is up 37% since the gun ban was instituted. Since the gun ban was instituted gun crimes are up. Since Florida started issuing carry permits the gun violence rate is down 36%. It dropped 30% in Texas when the permits were allowed.

You're also more likely to drown in your own pool than get wounded from a gun accident.

Let's look at China, where guns are next to impossible to come by. Knife deaths are higher than gun deaths in America per capita. If you think its just guns that are the problem, you're wrong.

Or let's look at the #1 killer in the US. A baseball bat. For about 35 years in a row the FBI has stated that the weapon used for the most murders was a baseball bat. Where are the outcries about how holding a bat makes you a more dangerous person and changes your psyche? It's because it doesn't.

All of my facts are based on the following site, which collected its data from the government and other institutions.

http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp
 
ADOGG80 said:
I'll have to agree with BB, and DD here for the most part. Only thing I would argue is the whole pshycopath thing. I think there were just as many in the 50's-60's. I think we just didnt hear about it as much as we do nowadays with the media being what it is today.
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In the fifties fear mongering wasn't profitable
 
yogoshio said:
What I HATE about the anti-gun argument is that is based completely in "feels" facts, not reality. When looking at the US, it is statistically proven that the higher gun permit rates, the lower gun crimes. I don't care about other countries, because that's not what we're talking about. Our demographics are completely different from Europe and other nations.

Not only that, I could care less whether 99% of America wanted to ban guns, IT'S AGAINST THE CONSTITUTION. That's the whole reason it's there is to keep the masses from making the same mistakes from the past.

Remember the last time we required citizens to give up their guns? We slaughtered mass numbers of Native Americans. Based on survey data from a 2000 study published in the Journal of Quantitative Criminology, U.S. civilians use guns to defend themselves and others from crime at least 989,883 times per year.

Living in Chicago, I can't figure out how you could say gun control means less gun violence. Gun violence is up 37% since the gun ban was instituted. Since the gun ban was instituted gun crimes are up. Since Florida started issuing carry permits the gun violence rate is down 36%. It dropped 30% in Texas when the permits were allowed.

You're also more likely to drown in your own pool than get wounded from a gun accident.

Let's look at China, where guns are next to impossible to come by. Knife deaths are higher than gun deaths in America per capita. If you think its just guns that are the problem, you're wrong.

Or let's look at the #1 killer in the US. A baseball bat. For about 35 years in a row the FBI has stated that the weapon used for the most murders was a baseball bat. Where are the outcries about how holding a bat makes you a more dangerous person and changes your psyche? It's because it doesn't.

All of my facts are based on the following site, which collected its data from the government and other institutions.

http://www.justfacts.com/guncontrol.asp
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According to that same constitution black people are 3/5 of a person.

If you use the UNODC data you're dead wrong about China

Murders in China are 1 per capita while homicides just with guns in the United States are 3.6, for a total homicides is 4.8. Please prove me wrong, otherwise I'm going to just assume all statistics from that site are dead wrong.

Guns in Chicago are coming from other places where you can get a free gun with your morning coffee like Indiana. Thanks guys.

Your baseball bat thing is also complete crap

http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/baseballbats.asp
 
No 24 hour news cycle and the Eastern Block was plenty distracting.
That's an interesting snopes article. WTF was going on in the early 90s? I mean I didn't think I was that hard core in highschool, but suckas did need some killin'.:)

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4
 
I'm not going to get into statistics or not. All I'm saying is no one has the power to decide whether or not I can defend myself outside of my home. It's my right and I will decide if I carry or not.

You guys are going back and forth about statistics this, statistics that. It doesn't even matter! It comes down to your rights as a human.

We shouldn't stop getting Starbucks because they are against taking human rights away. We should go and buy extra because they don't want to try and control us.

http://youtu.be/dhXPlCjr0Vw
 
Herbie said:
No 24 hour news cycle and the Eastern Block was plenty distracting.
That's an interesting snopes article. WTF was going on in the early 90s? I mean I didn't think I was that hard core in highschool, but suckas did need some killin'.:)

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 4
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Population growing exponentially. Might be around the same per capita rate or a little more as the years before, but that's a total guess.
 
steveo9043 said:
I'm not going to get into statistics or not. All I'm saying is no one has the power to decide whether or not I can defend myself outside of my home. It's my right and I will decide if I carry or not.

You guys are going back and forth about statistics this, statistics that. It doesn't even matter! It comes down to your rights as a human.

We shouldn't stop getting Starbucks because they are against taking human rights away. We should go and buy extra because they don't want to try and control us.

http://youtu.be/dhXPlCjr0Vw
Click to expand...

Where you live it might be a right, in lots of other places it isn't. The point of the statistics is to decide whether it is a good thing for it to be a right.
 
You know, the anti-gun crowd can have their opinion. I'm fine with that.

With that being said, what are you going to do when three or more home invasion degenerates break into your house in the middle of the night? Do some kung fu? Kicks and punches work really well against armed intruders..... or are you going to call the cops and wait 5, 10, 15 minutes?

No thanks. I'll call the police to collect the bodies of the intruders, as long as they're armed of course. Otherwise the cops will arrive to three dudes face down with their fingers locked behind their heads.

And those stats the we all keep arguing about, keep in mind that they're based on a small selection of people willing to take a survey. Highly doubtful that actual gun owners, of which there are many, would vote to have their constitutional right taken away.

As we saw during Hurricane Katrina, there were bands of armed criminals wandering the streets and pillaging people's homes. Where were the cops and the government? Oh yeah, they weren't around...........
 
People that argue and protest against guns simple don't know the facts. I am a proud owner of many firearms and personally can't wait until concealed carry is possible in this state. With or without legal concealed carry a criminal/murderer will still be carrying one if they want, I just want to be able to protect my loved ones and myself in the same manner.
 
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